TwitterTrouble
25 Apr 2012
Mark Feinsand just reported on Twitter that Michael Pineda has a labrum tear and will undergo surgery Tuesday. Of all the things that can go wrong with a pitcher, shoulder problems are the worst. Brian Cashman has pronounced Pineda as out for 2012.
I am sure this will send people into a tizzy about how stupid it was to trade for Pineda in the first place and how you never trade a hitter for a pitcher. Let’s tackle that last part first.
Yes, I totally agree you never trade a hitter for a pitcher unless you don’t have a place to play the hitter. Until proven otherwise, Montero is not a big league catcher. Maybe he turns into one, but until he does don’t rush to judgement because the Yankees did not have a place to play Montero if they didn’t think he can catch on a regular basis. Some will argue that they could have made him an everyday DH, but that spot is taken by a player rotation and will become A-Rod’s permanent spot in the next few years. Montero’s value wasn’t going to go higher this season, in fact you could argue it is lower right now, so they had to act when they did.
So that brings us back to how stupid it was to trade for Pineda. I have a hard time believing that the people who think that today thought that back in January. Back then, most intelligent baseball people thought the Yankees were getting a future ace. He represented a very talented young player who was under team control for the next five years and had a very solid season of pitching at the big league level under his belt. And please, don’t tell me you think the Mariners knew he was hurt or the Yankees doctors missed something. Pitchers get hurt, it’s the nature of the business.
It would be interesting to hear the complaints today if Montero was still a Yankee. Since he is hitting .254/.270/.373, I imagine we would hear cries of overrated and bust attached to him. We’ll never know for sure. But, we need to wait a few years before we can truly declare a winner or a loser in this trade. Noesi has an ERA over 9 while Campos has a 1.23 ERA in 22 innings at A ball. In five years maybe we refer to this as the Montero for Campos trade, who knows?
What we do know is that for 2012 the Yankees made a gamble and lost. Personally, I don’t think it will be the lack of Montero’s bat that keeps them from winning this year, rather it will be a lack of pitching. That’s what the Pineda trade was supposed to address in the first place.
Apr 25, 2012 @ 19:09:13
Peter – I am reading that the tear will be repaired using a scope procedure only – meaning minimally destructive. The rotator cuff is not damaged. This is about as good a piece of good news we can get in the midst of a bad situation. And yes, it’s a year recovery from what I am reading.
This trade was hot prospect for hot prospect. I had my suspicions about Pineda due to his 2nd half struggles, but I probably would still have made the trade because, as you point out, we had no place for Montero and Pineda looked like pure upside: we could always find a place for a good or great pitcher.
Apr 26, 2012 @ 08:13:55
In 10 years, you may look back at the trade and say “crap, that was a mistake” or as likely it will be a non-event as most trades are.
Is it a Bagwell for Anderson deal? Unlikely.
Apr 26, 2012 @ 10:09:39
With Swisher going free agency next year, there was a place for Montero as an outfielder. And this year, I’d rather have Montero out there than Andruw Jones.
The pitcher only gives you value every 5th day; so the even-up trade of batter for pitcher only makes sense if the pitcher is outstanding. Pineda is having season-ending surgery and who knows what his durability will be in the future. You just can’t spin this as a good trade. It’s a disaster. We should have known he was damaged goods based on his performance in the last half of last year.
Apr 26, 2012 @ 18:04:34
Corey
I used to think that about Montero too, in fact I think I posted about trying him in left. But there was an interview Cashman gave last year, late in the year when he was asked that specific question and flatly said Montero couldn’t handle the outfield. Based on that, I don’t think the Yankees had a spot to put him in.
Now, I am not saying it was a good trade right now, obviously not. But, we also don’t know how he will respond to surgery. Curt Schilling had the same surgery when he was 28 and had a brilliant career afterwards. Other pitchers never made it back. Until we see how all the pieces in this trade perform over the long term, I just can’t see how we can judge it.
Apr 26, 2012 @ 18:07:37
BL
Good point and I will translate what you said into Yankee language
“Is it Buhner for Phelps? Unlikely”
Apr 26, 2012 @ 19:06:28
Did the Mariners knowingly trade damaged goods to the Yankees? Who (besides they themselves) knows? Frustrating as this is, gnashing our teeth isn’t going to solve anything. It is still way too early to judge this trade (as some on the sports sites have already done). At this point, I’m far more interested in knowing what the Yankees are doing to get Hughes on track. Garcia is old and may be done. CC will be fine. Nova has been a really pleasant surprise. Hughes is key — what’s being done? It’s getting so frustrating having him get pounded start after start. It’s time for him to contribute (as a starter).
Peter: Was that your post on PinstripedBible.com? I liked it.
Apr 26, 2012 @ 20:37:55
help me Peter, is it Buhner or Phelps that you are equating to Bagwell…I don’t see it either way myself
Apr 26, 2012 @ 22:35:15
Greg
He expressed it far more eloquently than I did, but thank you!
And from what I have read, a regular MRI wouldn’t have caught this damage, so I can’t blame Seattle.
Apr 26, 2012 @ 22:37:00
BL
I know Bagwell is a much, much better player, but Yankees fans bemoan the Buhner trade to this day.
Apr 27, 2012 @ 07:00:40
we’ve had that discussion previously, just messing with ya