TwitterYanks Are Out!
14 Dec 2010
Well, the stuff in italics is what I was piecing together before I read the Jon Heyman tweet saying the Yankees are out of the Cliff Lee sweepstakes. I was going to suggest that the Yankees pull their offer. Looks like that has been done for them.
I hadn’t gotten to it yet, but I was going to point out that while Boston is better, what other team in the AL East can say that right now? Tampa is certainly not and I don’t think Baltimore or Toronto are either. There will certainly be more competition from teams like Chicago, but the Yankees as presently constructed should be considered a strong contender for a playoff spot.
What I would do now is move Joba back into the rotation and go with Ivan Nova in the fifth spot. Andy Pettitte scares me at his age and he seems likely to retire anyway. To back up those guys, I would spend heavily in the bullpen. I would call Rafael Soriano and see how much money he wants to be a setup guy/stand by closer. Rivera pitched 60 innings last year, there are going to be plenty of save opportunities in the future for the rest of the bullpen and if I am the Yankees I would make that case to Soriano. They can certainly afford to pay him closer money now.
I would also sign Feliciano to be a lefty in the pen and get Russell Martin done. I’m going to sleep on this a bit more. Keep reading if you want to see my train of thought before this all went down.
This Cliff Lee dance is getting stupid. Now Lee and his agent have every right in the world to keep shopping for what they want, but the Yankees also have the right to change their mind. It’s obvious that Lee isn’t jumping at the chance to come to New York. He is reportedly talking to Philadelphia and seeing if they can come close enough money-wise to make it worth spurning the Yankees or Rangers.
You know what as a baseball fan, I hope Lee goes to Philadelphia. I never thought they should have traded him in the first place and you would have to think that a rotation of Doc, Lee and Oswalt would keep the Phils near the top of the NL for awhile.
As for the Yankees, yes it leaves a tremendous hole in the 2011 rotation. But as I have said multiple times, seven years is too long for Lee. The Yankees are banking on winning the World Series in 2011 or 2012 with this deal and I think they can still compete for the title without this deal. Signing this deal would lock the Yankees into paying over $100 million to A-Rod, Jeter, Sabathia, Lee and Burnett alone in 2013.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 00:49:11
Peter,
I was going to post to the previous thread, but it looks like you beat me to the punch. 7 years/$140 mullion was far too much. Good for Cliff Lee — he took substantially less money to go where he thought he’d be happiest. Good for Philly, too. They have the means and the wherewithal to play with the big boys, so why shouldn’t they? They made a foolish mistake trading him away in the first place. Now they have probably the best rotation since those Oriole teams of 1969-1971. Good for baseball, too. Can’t have the Yankees buying up anybody they want. It’s not good for competitive balance and breeds resentment (not to mention “luxury taxes”).
As for throwing money at the bullpen, the Yankees have tried that in the past. Didn’t work out too well. Bullpens (other than elite closers) are generally volatile. It’s the nature of the beast.
I’d really like to believe that the Yankees will walk away from this learning that throwing more money will not always be an option. If they could combine the player development skills of, say, the Twins with their financial resources they’d be awesome. They need to find a more sustainable approach than the one they’re using now.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 02:25:07
I don’t see how you can go into this season with Sabathia, Burnett, Hughes, Joba, Nova as your rotation. You need someone you can count on for some innings besides Sabathia and Hughes. Maybe its not Pettite but its gotta be somebody. There are plenty of somebody’s to take a chance on. Webb, Bedard, Young … and I disagree with spending money on the bullpen, you can’t handicap middlemen month to month, let alone year to year. Too hard to handicap. For me, get a starter in AND welcome Petitte back with open arms. Nova and Joba to the to the pen.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 07:01:34
Actually? I am sort of relieved that Lee is going to Philly. We won’t have to face him until the postseason (I haven’t yet checked interleague play for 2011) and – yep Peter – pitchers are too fragile to throw huge money at for 6 or 7 years. With Lee’s back problems, I think the Phils may be moaning about their contract soon enough.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 07:23:19
yeah but they are looking for WS win #2 and #3 immediately while they have the core players all signed. I don’t blame Philly, doesn’t look too good for the Braves right now though
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:00:34
Greg
I think they are getting in player development, but they have a way to go.
That being said, it is quite possible that guys like Banuelos, Betances and Phelps all contribute later in 2011. And, one of them could definitely be a part of the 2012 rotation.
And I agree about the bullpen, that’s why I want Soriano, he is an elite closer I want to use in a different way.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:07:17
Tim
I agree that they could take a flier, but in the bigger picture wouldn’t it make more sense to try and fill the spot from within?
I am not suggesting that Nova is going to become a superstar, but until the Yankees commit to developing young pitchers, they are always going to have to bid on guys like Cliff Lee.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:09:01
BL
Don’t you mean #28 and #29
I think the Yankees have more than enough talent to be in contention at the trade deadline. They can always go out and get someone then if they need it.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:10:19
Blanton should be available from Philly right about now…
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:13:54
obviously I was referring to the Phillies and this century. But nice comeback anyway
post about Blanton being available was from me, somehow fields were blank when I hit “send”
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:37:33
I wonder if the Mets would ever consider trading Santana? He will be 32 with health problems and they are paying him top money. Given that the Mets are rebuilding, maybe they’d like to send that salary and risk over to the Yankees.
I don’t like any of the pitchers on the market. Buehrle is inconsistent; Bonderman is another A.J.; Pavano is Pavano.
Not a lot of options here. I guesss it’s time to let Nova and Joba have a chance.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:41:13
BL-
I got it now. And last I heard, Blanton is headed to Boston. Though I can’t figure out why.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 09:43:08
Corey
Very interesting idea. Throw in all the speculation that the Mets owners lost a bundle with Madoff and it could make a lot of sense.
But, the Yankees would have to wait and see him pitch in March since he is coming back from shoulder surgery.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 12:45:12
The interesting thing about this bit of drama is that Lee calmly watched two teams publicly set the bar for salary and years – then he picked a team that he WANTED to pitch for and got them to basically match the annual salary for a five year deal. Lee and his agent are the real winners here – well played !
Dec 14, 2010 @ 14:11:56
Peter,
I’ll believe the younger guys will contribute when I see them do so. I’ve been jaded by the hype machine. So far, the reality has paled considerably compared to the hype.
I don’t see Soriano accepting anything less than The Closer position. Ego and all.
I don’t see the Mets trading a top-tier player like Santana to the Yankees. Not gonna happen.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 14:56:07
Greg
I understand that, but if the Yankees don’t give them a chance they will spend their way into oblivion.
Cano has done pretty well. Hughes is a solid starter at least. Robertson has turned into an above-average option in the pen. Don’t write the whole crew off!
Dec 14, 2010 @ 14:56:58
Mitchell-
Yup, great job by the agent. Sort of the anti-Boras approach.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 14:58:18
Greg
Forgot to mention, you are probably right about Soriano, but Mariano’s age scares me. The Yankees need a plan B for him as well.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 16:06:26
Peter? Last comment for me in this thread – about Joba.
I have always thought that Joba’s stuff was good enough to make him a starter for us. The issue was and remains, always, in his “head” (read maturity, focus, tenacity. etc). Some guys mature early, some late, some never do. Joba being another year older and having lived through some humbling experiences as a pro ballplayer – I would give him a look this Spring.
If he’s focused, if he can stay within himself and just let his stuff roll easily towards the plate – then we have another starter, if not, well then he stays in the pen and just has to remember to ignite his hair just before he opens the gate from the pen onto the field during a game. Never hurts to give him a another look … regardless of what Cashman has stated for the record about Joba being a RP now.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 17:22:30
Mitchell
I keep going back to the fact that he was a good starter in 2009 until they started throwing the rules around (7-2 3.58 ERA through end of July)
That guy is still in there and considering the alternatives, why wouldn’t the Yankees see if they can find him again?
Dec 14, 2010 @ 17:24:10
Hey Peter, I think Nova can be quite servicable but he was solid for just about 5 innings and then fell apart, can his arm handle 30 starts? Joba, I won’t slit my wrists if he is plan B but I think its too risky to have them as your 4 and 5 starters. Especially when you have no idea what your #3 gives you in Burnett. I say give me Pettite one more time.
Dec 14, 2010 @ 17:54:06
Tim
Very true. I wouldn’t mind a flier on Pettitte, but I wouldn’t back up a Brinks truck for him either. I figure he is good for 20-25 starts max.